Brinks security system - armed to the gills

[John Stone]

Hello,

I've been doing some reading of this NG and have learned a lot. Thank
you to everyone that offers the outstanding feedback which led me to
interview multiple security companies to protect my new home and wife.

I have the following configuration in mind:

2 Pads (one upstairs, one down)
4 Door contacts (Main/Garage entry/Garage to House/Sliding Patio)
8 window contacts (6 1st floor, 2 2nd accessible via overhang)
2 motion detectors (Family / Living)
1 fire detector (upstairs)
1 heat sensor (basement next to control panel)
1 remote panic button/fob
Cut phone line sensor
Battery Backup

The three companies I interviewed were Amherst Alarm (local), Brinks,
and Guardian.

I immediately eliminated Guardian because the rep said they would use
all wireless devices and I'd rather have a wired system. Plus, the
install cost ($940) was a hair lower than my other options while their
monitoring cost ($27/mo) was twice as high.

Amherst Alarm I'm still considering if only for their level of
service. The rep seemed very genuine and he made me comfortable with
the level of service I would get with this locally operated company.
(I'm in Buffalo, NY) Their install price is $995 and monitoring is
$14.67/mo. They offer a wireless backup (radio transmitter) for an
additional $10/mo.

Brinks started out with a $700 install price and a monthly monitoring
rate of $29. When I mentioned I would like to keep the monthly costs
lower, he told me that I could go through their "Direct" program where
monitoring etc. would be done locally, and through this program the
install would be $1100 and monthly cost $13.33 - I then showed him the
Amherst quote and he agreed to beat it - $945 for the install and
$13.33/mo.

My question is this - I know many people here are against the national
chains. By going this route am I technically "going local"? He said
that instead of the Texas location they use a UL approved local
monitoring station. The hardware would be "slightly different" (I
will get more details about this) but otherwise all will be the same.
Are there any other questions I should ask?

For the amount of hardware I'm getting - does this seem like a good
way to go?

Also, if you've read this far you won't mind one other quick question.
What do people do with double-hung windows? If the contact is
installed on the bottom of the window, what if the intruder breaks the
glass and pulls down?

Thank you!
John & Wife

 

[fly in the ointment]

John Stone wrote

Brinks started out with a $700 install price and a monthly monitoring
rate of $29. When I mentioned I would like to keep the monthly costs
lower, he told me that I could go through their "Direct" program where
monitoring etc. would be done locally, and through this program the
install would be $1100 and monthly cost $13.33 - I then showed him the
Amherst quote and he agreed to beat it - $945 for the install and
$13.33/mo.

Interesting how Brinks came down in price when you showed him the local
guy's bid. I would ask him why his price was so high to begin with. ( We
were going to gouge you, but since you have this honest quote, we'll lower
our price.) Is he serious?

Go with the local guy, and tell Brinks to shove it.
js

 

[dep_blueman]

We are having a very similar Brinks system installed in our home:

2 Pads (one upstairs, one down)
4 Door contacts
11 window contacts
2 motion detectors (Family / Living)
1 fire detector (upstairs)
1 heat sensor (basement next to control panel)
2 water bugs for the basement sumps
1 Cellular backup

Brinks was very agressive in price at ~$750 for everything but the
cellular. That is $500 +15/m. Monitoring $23/month + 15 for cell.
They own the equiptment which is Ademco Vista 30PSE.

The install tech came yesterday and is doing a great job. He put
everything exactly where I wanted it even though it made it a good
deal harder for him to install. No push back at all. The wiring
looks like it was done by a prof. data center wiring guy; tight,
clean, and out of the way. He worked from 9AM-9PM and will be back on
Saturday to finish the job. When I said I wanted 12 zones (they offer
8 on the panel) he offered a zone exander for ~$22. That seemed good.

Here is what he says on dbl hung: You need two contacts BUT they only
charge $20 for the second contact. Same goes for two single hung
windows side by side. So, that saved us a good deal of money as we
had 4 sets of 2 windows side by side. If you need glass break they
can do that as well either on the window (for single window converage)
or as a module that covers ~7M at 90 deg.

We had Brinks at our previous home so we got $500 off the install (1/2
price up to a $500 discount) and the basic system (key, 3 door,
motion) 'free'. The installer also offered another ~$250 discount as
they had to reschedule on me. That is all reflected in the $750 price
so there is a good deal of room for 'savings' off their full price.
ADT came in at ~$1000 more and would not do some of the things I
wanted.

They were also willing to program the system to my specs including
entry delays and zones, zero reporting delays, and the
placement/config. of the cellular radio.

The only thing that I really wanted that I could not get out of Brinks
was the custom 'english language' keypads that display the zones by
name rather than by zone number. I know Ademco has them but Brinks
only does the LCDs /w zone numbers. I have a felling that if I had
purchased them in advance he would have programed them for me but I
did not think that far ahead.

Before someone asks, YES, they own the equiptment and have the right
to take it out (or get it back) if you cancel service with them. This
is a risk that you may not have with a local installer or even ADT so
you have to consider it in the pricing. For us, owning the hardware
was not worth over $1000 but to others it might be.

This is in the Chicagoland market.

-D

 

[G. Siegle]

I love how a company will drop their price once you have caught them with
their hand in your wallet.

Just the kind of honest company you should deal with.

They were going to give your their best price until you showed them the
competitors price, then their best price got better.

Just my 2 cents

 

[C G]

We are having a very similar Brinks system installed in our home:

2 Pads (one upstairs, one down)
4 Door contacts
11 window contacts
2 motion detectors (Family / Living)
1 fire detector (upstairs)
1 heat sensor (basement next to control panel)
2 water bugs for the basement sumps
1 Cellular backup

Brinks was very agressive in price at ~$750 for everything but the
cellular. That is $500 +15/m. Monitoring $23/month + 15 for cell.

$38/month? Ouch.

They own the equiptment which is Ademco Vista 30PSE.

You pay them to put their equipment in your home? What a deal. They
should pay you for the opportunity to gouge you every month on
monitoring.

The install tech came yesterday and is doing a great job. He put
everything exactly where I wanted it even though it made it a good
deal harder for him to install. No push back at all. The wiring
looks like it was done by a prof. data center wiring guy; tight,
clean, and out of the way. He worked from 9AM-9PM and will be back on
Saturday to finish the job. When I said I wanted 12 zones (they offer
8 on the panel) he offered a zone exander for ~$22. That seemed good.

How nice that it only cost you $22 extra for them to install their
expander board in their panel.

Here is what he says on dbl hung: You need two contacts BUT they only
charge $20 for the second contact. Same goes for two single hung
windows side by side. So, that saved us a good deal of money as we
had 4 sets of 2 windows side by side. If you need glass break they
can do that as well either on the window (for single window converage)
or as a module that covers ~7M at 90 deg.

$20 for the second contact is probably not too bad, considering it does
take a little extra time. Did you happen to observe how many extra
minutes it took for the second contact? It would be interesting to
convert to an hourly rate.

We had Brinks at our previous home so we got $500 off the install (1/2
price up to a $500 discount) and the basic system (key, 3 door,
motion) 'free'. The installer also offered another ~$250 discount as
they had to reschedule on me. That is all reflected in the $750 price
so there is a good deal of room for 'savings' off their full price.
ADT came in at ~$1000 more and would not do some of the things I
wanted.

You got nothing 'free', they still own the equipment.

They were also willing to program the system to my specs including
entry delays and zones, zero reporting delays, and the
placement/config. of the cellular radio.

I would not expect less. The system is useless if it is not programmed
in a manner consistant with the occupants of the house.

The only thing that I really wanted that I could not get out of Brinks
was the custom 'english language' keypads that display the zones by
name rather than by zone number. I know Ademco has them but Brinks
only does the LCDs /w zone numbers. I have a felling that if I had
purchased them in advance he would have programed them for me but I
did not think that far ahead.

Unfortunate that they were not interested in delivering the system
exactly as you wanted.

Before someone asks, YES, they own the equiptment and have the right
to take it out (or get it back) if you cancel service with them. This
is a risk that you may not have with a local installer or even ADT so
you have to consider it in the pricing. For us, owning the hardware
was not worth over $1000 but to others it might be.

Perhaps I missed it, but how long are you required to stay with them?
Any penalty for cancelling early? What happens if you move before the
end of your contract?

 

[C G]

I love how a company will drop their price once you have caught them with
their hand in your wallet.

Just the kind of honest company you should deal with.

They were going to give your their best price until you showed them the
competitors price, then their best price got better.

This business practice was not created by Brinks, or any other security
vendor. Happens in any business transaction where the seller is willing
to negotiate price or terms. Think about it. Did you pay list price
for your car? If you buy a house do you pay the sellers asking price?
It is not unreasonable for a security company, or any other business, to
make an offer and then agree to negotiate it down.

Chuck

 

[John Stone]

Hi,

Yes, this was a Brinks dealer. And he readily told me that there were
differences between the local deal ($13.33/mo) and the national one
($29.99/mo).

National uses the Texas monitoring station
Local program uses a "local monitoring station" that is UL approved

So he's a Brinks dealer - does that mean that if I go with the Local
program I won't be going through a national security provider? Does
anyone have any idea what these local Brinks guys are all about?

Also, double hung windows - how do you protect against someone opening
them the "other" way? Does this just not happen?

HAPPY THANKSGIVING!!!

- John & Wife

 

[Mark]

Also, double hung windows - how do you protect against someone opening
them the "other" way? Does this just not happen?

If the switch is installed correctly, it will detect an open window either way.

 

[Rory]

What system was it?? Vista 30 only has 2 hard wired zones. Was
everything wireless?? If so, why do you mention wired runs? Looks like
you have 21 zones unless they teamed up alot of the windows etc. which
is not good. Vista 20 can only get you 16 zones with an expander,
maybe this was a vista 50?? Or did they just team up alot of zones or
was some wireless??

Anyway, prices of parts, not including control panel, & if its
wireless, reciever:

approx. US prices:

2 Pads (one upstairs, one down) @ $50 ea - $100
4 Door contacts - $10 (max)
11 window contacts $10 (including 1 from door bag)
2 motion detectors (Family / Living) @ $12 ea - $24
1 fire detector (upstairs) - $30
1 heat sensor (basement next to control panel) - $30
2 water bugs for the basement sumps @ $50 ea - $100

Total parts - $304 (PLUS control panel, battery etc)

With all those window and door switches i can see the labour not being
cheap though, if it is indeed hard wired.

Why would you pay for something that you wont own, and then you have
had to sign a contract of all things too, so if you pull out they take
you to court??!

Just wondering..

 

[dep_blueman]

Perhaps I missed it, but how long are you required to stay with them?
Any penalty for cancelling early? What happens if you move before the
end of your contract?

No, I did not add that part. It is a 3 year contract. The penalty
for eary cncl is the full payment of the monthly price through the
36th month. If you move you still have to pay.

For us, however, the chances of moving in 3 years is VERY low and we
don't expect to want to change security systems in those 3 years. But
it is a risk.

FYI, ADT was the same on the contracts and the locals we talked to
were more or less the same. All had MUCH higher install prices though
you owned the hardware; still locked into the contract.

-D

 

[thesatguy]

They are just dealers that sell their contracts to Brinks sometimes instead
of one of the other paper mills.

 

[C G]

I make it a practice to hold my price and if someone doesn't want to pay it, I
remove something from the menu to see if it meets their price level ...or
............. they go somewhere else.

So does Saturn. It is fine if you choose to do business this way. The
fact is that others do not follow your business model. Neither is
wrong, they are just different. Unfortunately, it seems you have
trouble respecting anyone who does not agree with your opinion.

 

[C G]

No, I did not add that part. It is a 3 year contract. The penalty
for eary cncl is the full payment of the monthly price through the
36th month. If you move you still have to pay.

For us, however, the chances of moving in 3 years is VERY low and we
don't expect to want to change security systems in those 3 years. But
it is a risk.

FYI, ADT was the same on the contracts and the locals we talked to
were more or less the same. All had MUCH higher install prices though
you owned the hardware; still locked into the contract.

Since it's a done deal, you are stuck for 3 years. For the benefit of
others who may be watching and are considering alternatives, I received
a price from a local company for a similar level of monitoring, better
equipment, which I would own, lower monthly charge, and not locked in
for any length of time. Of course I ended up installing my own...

 

[dep_blueman]

My understanding (which could be incorrect) is that Brinks uses the
Vista 30PSE with its 8 zone option installed/configured custom branded
for Brinks.

However, after reviewing the Ademco site it is not clear if the 30PSE
can be expanded past 8 hardware zones and the installer clearly stated
that they can support up to 96 zones on the panel. Even the 50 says
it can only do 64 zones. So, either I don't fully understand the
specs or Brinks has the Ademco custom made for its use and does not
exactly match any of the Vista panels. Or, the installer really ment
64 zones and it IS the Vista 50.

That said, it will all be hardwired thus the need for a zone expander.
I think I came up with 12 or 13 zones total. Some windows (in the
same physical loc) will be on one zone as I have no need in knowing if
it was the first window on the right or the second or the thrid, etc.
Everything else on its own zone.

-D

 

[C G]

Alarminex wrote:

If it's my opinion then I think that it's right.

That's obvious.

If it's right for me, then someone who disagrees with me is wrong.

Open minded people can accept that other people can be different without
labeling them wrong, or resorting to insulting them.

It may not be wrong for them, but it's wrong for me.
OK


If they think they can convince me that they are right, they'd better be
prepared to defend, justify and prove to me that they are right and be sure
that's it's all worth the effort. If they can't do that, then ........ they're
still wrong.

No, they are just wrong from your perspective. They might decide that
it's not worth their time to justify themselves to you.

Tough for some to accept but, I'm sure you'll manage.

No, I have a pretty good idea what you are about.

By your comment, I see that you also have a problem with someone elses opinion.

No, I have a problem with people who feel they need to insult people who
have a different way of doing things.

Unfortunately, you obviously care that I don't agree with you.

Long ago I stopped caring what you think.

Fortunately, I don't.

Yes, that's obvious.

I've been around long enough to know that what I do is successful. You're
mileage may vary.

There is more than one way to be successful. You seem to like insulting
people who do things different from you. That is where we disagree.

 

[C G]

Why do people spend $250/month to lease a car that they do not own.

The main reason is if you are using it for business. Every study I have
ever read concluded that leasing a car for personal use is a bad
decision.

 

[fly in the ointment]

Marc Mazzarese wrote

Why do people spend $250/month to lease a car that they do not own.

Usually either for business tax reasons, or because they want a new car
every 2-3 years.
js

 

[J. Sloud]

My question is this - I know many people here are against the national
chains. By going this route am I technically "going local"? He said
that instead of the Texas location they use a UL approved local
monitoring station. The hardware would be "slightly different" (I
will get more details about this) but otherwise all will be the same.
Are there any other questions I should ask?

Sounds like the old bait-n-switch. Some of these "authorized dealers"
will do business on the side that has nothing to do with the national
company they represent.

So the price for the Brinks system was a little high. They just
switch you to another product with a cheaper price. They're really
just a local alarm company, anyway. Be warned, though: The system
will have nothing to do with Brinks.

 

[Mark]

And how would that be?

Sensor on one sash and mag switch on the other - in the middle where the 2
sashes meet? Am I missing something?

 

[RH.Campbell]

Because if a vehicle is used for business, then it's tax deductible (at
least where I do business). My truck is leased, and is a $10,000 tax
deduction when you total up lease costs, insurance, gas and oil times my
percentage use for business. As my dealer said one time..."Bob, you can give
it to me and drive a nice new truck every two years, or you can give it to
the government"...(now that's what I call a "no brainer"....))

An alarm system on the other hand is a "small potato" item and it is IMO a
very foolish move for a consumer to lease the thing just to save some
relatively minor up front costs. But then I also think that it's a foolish
move for a consumer to sign a long term contract too, and most don't agree
with me on that either.......so who the hell knows !!!....

Hey !!...go for it if it suits your purposes.....))

RHC