No voltage across power out terminals and speaker playing

[Jamie]

Your analogy is excellent. I'll have to rethink that one over.

 

[John Fields]

What was it that Kirk said....
oh yes, "Jackson Roy Kirk, your creator is dead! You have mistaken me for
him....
You have made an error! You are flawed and imperfect...You did not detect
your
mistake, YOU have made two errors...and you did not correct by
sterilization, you
have made three errors!"

"Execute your primary function"

(excerpt from 'The Changeling')

---
Nice

Even neglecting Asimov's rules, as I recall them, the primary
directive was self-destruction (or, at least, neutralization) of the
robot when a logical quandary was reached which would lead to the
loss of human life in favor of a robot's "life".

 

[Greg Neill]

How can it all be, if I play *exact* same signal (calibration signal
from RightMark AA)
and on every device, but the Marantz, it all works! Should I assume my
receiver is damaged? (Irony warning)

Maybe all but the Marantz has a DC offset voltage
showing up at the output.

 

[[email protected]]

Excuse this guys, but what you now wrote, made me go mad.
I KNOW HOW to use a multimeter and I KNOW what is AC.
Please, don't make a monkey of me.

You all seem to be ignoring the fact, that even the soundcard didn't
register *any* voltage at its line input, be it distorted/clipped or
not.

Are you still going to tell me, to check if my DMM is set to AC?!

I've told you all, that DMM *is* in the mode and in fact, I have
measured a
p-p voltage of my cd player line out without any problems.

Apart from that, you have grossly gone offtopic.
Sorry, but you were helpful in the beginning, now you are telling bs.

There is no point drawing ascii diagram, as this is a simple
voltage divider.

 

[[email protected]]

Maybe all but the Marantz has a DC offset voltage
showing up at the output.

I doubt any of my amps have an offset of 10+ volts...

 

[Don Bowey]

Excuse this guys, but what you now wrote, made me go mad.
I KNOW HOW to use a multimeter and I KNOW what is AC.
Please, don't make a monkey of me.

(snip)

You did that yourself by totally ignoring, even rebuffing, the good advice
you were given.

 

[[email protected]]

You have now shown, a good old method, to make a brainwash out of
people who ask the question, the moment when you don't know the correct
answer.
That is, when you fear to admit it.

The method is - To persuade somebody, that he/she doesn't know what
he/she is doing.
And then let him/her go away and stop asking.

 

[Don Bowey]

You have now shown, a good old method, to make a brainwash out of
people who ask the question, the moment when you don't know the correct
answer.
That is, when you fear to admit it.

The method is - To persuade somebody, that he/she doesn't know what
he/she is doing.
And then let him/her go away and stop asking.

What is it I fear to admit? See if you can be at least a little clear on
this.

Well, let's see....
1. You say that although you hear sound from the speaker, there is NO AC
voltage across the speaker terminals while the sound is heard. Is this
correct or not?

2. In normal speaker operation, a voltage applied to the speaker causes a
current flow in the circuit resulting in the speaker cone moving, which is
heard as a "sound." This IS correct.

3. If there is no signal voltage applied to the speaker, there can be no
sound created by the speaker. This IS correct.

What is you opinion of what is the problem?

 

[Tim Auton]

Thanks for that. I too found the inherent contradiction in Jamie's sig
deeply perplexing. I'll sleep well tonight for the first time in weeks.
Well, as soon as I find out what all those damn chickens were doing
crossing the road. I find the provided explanations somewhat
implausible.


Tim

 

[Roger Dewhurst]

What is it I fear to admit? See if you can be at least a little clear on
this.

Well, let's see....
1. You say that although you hear sound from the speaker, there is NO AC
voltage across the speaker terminals while the sound is heard. Is this
correct or not?

2. In normal speaker operation, a voltage applied to the speaker causes a
current flow in the circuit resulting in the speaker cone moving, which is
heard as a "sound." This IS correct.

3. If there is no signal voltage applied to the speaker, there can be no
sound created by the speaker. This IS correct.

So far so good. The indications are that the OP has a meter that works and
he knows how to use it. The question that needs to be addressed is how he
gets the results that he gets without immediately assuming that he is a
cretin.

I wonder whether he has measured the output from the amplifier with the
speaker disconnected or with a resistor connected in its place.

Has he measured the voltage between each of the speaker inputs and ground?

R

 

[Jamie]

Excuse this guys, but what you now wrote, made me go mad.
I KNOW HOW to use a multimeter and I KNOW what is AC.
Please, don't make a monkey of me.

You all seem to be ignoring the fact, that even the soundcard didn't
register *any* voltage at its line input, be it distorted/clipped or
not.

Are you still going to tell me, to check if my DMM is set to AC?!

I've told you all, that DMM *is* in the mode and in fact, I have
measured a
p-p voltage of my cd player line out without any problems.

Apart from that, you have grossly gone offtopic.
Sorry, but you were helpful in the beginning, now you are telling bs.

There is no point drawing ascii diagram, as this is a simple
voltage divider.

DMM's (most of them) do not respond high frequency AC.
some only go up to 400 Hz. or so. others more, it depends
on your DMM.

 

[Lord Garth]

Excuse this guys, but what you now wrote, made me go mad.
I KNOW HOW to use a multimeter and I KNOW what is AC.
Please, don't make a monkey of me.

You all seem to be ignoring the fact, that even the soundcard didn't
register *any* voltage at its line input, be it distorted/clipped or
not.

Are you still going to tell me, to check if my DMM is set to AC?!

I've told you all, that DMM *is* in the mode and in fact, I have
measured a
p-p voltage of my cd player line out without any problems.

Apart from that, you have grossly gone offtopic.
Sorry, but you were helpful in the beginning, now you are telling bs.

There is no point drawing ascii diagram, as this is a simple
voltage divider.

Fine, figure it out for yourself or publish your zero point energy results.

 

[Ross Herbert]

Hello!

I have a Marantz SR4600 receiver.I wanted to measure it's approximated
performance
with an excellent quality sound card and RightMark AudioAnalyzer.

I have a neccessary voltage divider for speaker-to-line levels
conversion.
My other amp, Technics SU-V4X works ok.No problems at all.

With Marantz, I have no voltage reported across speaker terminals
when measuring with a multimeter and playing a sine tone through
speaker.

Still the speaker is playing very loud.

To be assured, I also connected the receiver to pc's line in.
Here a signal is not sensed too, although I've fiddled with volume.
So, I doubt it is a multimeter's fault.

I don't have much experience with various exotic amp designs...
So possibly I'm missing something.

Maybe, this has something to do that (perhaps) Marantz used
switching mode discrete amps?

With sincere greetings,
Daniel K.

It appears as if Daniel is not getting any better results from his own
native language speaking respondents...
http://groups.google.com.au/group/p...d8d0d/dabe883324642371?hl=en#dabe883324642371

there seems to be a fair amount of ? being asked, but unfortunately
the various on-line Polish - English translators don't recognise many
of the words so I can't tell much from what is being said. Marantz
SR4600 is unmistakable though...

 

[[email protected]]

There is something strange.I again have played with measurements today.
There is voltage across speaker terminals, but begins to show up from
-15dB volume setting! and It is way too small!

There is just 2VAC with volume at -10dB!
(with max being +18dB and min. -71dB)
Without *any* voltage divider on the way, just plain speaker terminals.

I just don't understand... this is way more powerful amp than that...
And it is not a dmm's fault, as I've hooked it up to the soundcard and
it *barely* sensed a voltage across line in (too low for RightMark
Analyzer to work and I don't believe it is accurate enough to amplify
the signal with some audio software...).

 

[Greg Neill]

There is something strange.I again have played with measurements today.
There is voltage across speaker terminals, but begins to show up from
-15dB volume setting! and It is way too small!

There is just 2VAC with volume at -10dB!
(with max being +18dB and min. -71dB)
Without *any* voltage divider on the way, just plain speaker terminals.

I just don't understand... this is way more powerful amp than that...
And it is not a dmm's fault, as I've hooked it up to the soundcard and
it *barely* sensed a voltage across line in (too low for RightMark
Analyzer to work and I don't believe it is accurate enough to amplify
the signal with some audio software...).

What is the signal you are using? Try a simple 60Hz
tone to avoid running into frequency response
limitations of the DMM.

 

[[email protected]]

What is the signal you are using? Try a simple 60Hz
tone to avoid running into frequency response
limitations of the DMM.

I'm using RMAA calibration signal.I've just also tested 60Hz,
as you instructed.Results:

-15dB: 5,5 VAC
-10dB: 10,5 VAC
-5dB: 19 VAC
-4dB: 21 VAC

Hmm... seems like amp's logarythmic volume slope is very soft...

What do you think about it?

 

[Greg Neill]

I'm using RMAA calibration signal.I've just also tested 60Hz,
as you instructed.Results:

-15dB: 5,5 VAC
-10dB: 10,5 VAC
-5dB: 19 VAC
-4dB: 21 VAC

Hmm... seems like amp's logarythmic volume slope is very soft...

What do you think about it?

I'm afraid that I'm not familiar with the expected
curve for audio equipment (it must depend upon the
actual sensitivity of the human ear with respect
to audio power, which is probably not an entirely
perfect logarithmic curve). Maybe a web search
will turn up something?

 

[The Phantom]

I'm using RMAA calibration signal.I've just also tested 60Hz,
as you instructed.Results:

-15dB: 5,5 VAC
-10dB: 10,5 VAC
-5dB: 19 VAC
-4dB: 21 VAC

Hmm... seems like amp's logarythmic volume slope is very soft...

What do you think about it?

Daniel, can you re-create the setup you had when you first posted?

You said you heard a sound from the speaker, but you couldn't measure any
signal at the speaker terminals.

If you have that situation again, place a short circuit across the
speaker terminals with a heavy piece of copper wire. If the sound goes
away, or is greatly reduced, then the inescapable conclusion is that there
*is* a signal there, but you have a measurement problem.

 

[Greg Neill]

Daniel, can you re-create the setup you had when you first posted?

You said you heard a sound from the speaker, but you couldn't measure any
signal at the speaker terminals.

If you have that situation again, place a short circuit across the
speaker terminals with a heavy piece of copper wire. If the sound goes
away, or is greatly reduced, then the inescapable conclusion is that there
*is* a signal there, but you have a measurement problem.

Nasty.

 

[[email protected]]

Nasty.

Indeed But I think I can live with what I have now.I've done a
measure and I think we can abandon the topic.Thank you all who were
kind to me.