Sustainable Agriculture.

[Gerald L R Stubbs]

The message <[email protected]>

No, that was W.C. Fields, and the reference was to "small dogs and
children", IIRC.
Gordon Richmond

Thanks.

 

[William P.N. Smith]

yes, I'm forgetting my manners, greetings to all you good people over there,
trust everything is optimally energetic and both homely and renewable. Sorry
if we have been throwing too many buns at someone elses resident troll, but
it isn't often one finds a genuine quarterwit, and if we find one, we all
just have to go and poke it through the bars with a stick

Yes, hello to the Aggies! 8*) Amazing what we find to do for
entertainment, eh?

 

[William P.N. Smith]

I can, for example, get a report from the Usenet Archives on
any alias just by pressing "_" when the menu is up:

http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search

Aha, that's where he gets that broken stuff!

Elaine Jones
Results 1 - 100 of 589 posts in the last year

And then of course, you either haven't posted enough, in which case
you are a sockpuppet without your own online identity, or you've
posted too much, which makes you a troll. Ah, well, keeps me from the
other Idiot Box. 8*)

 

[Elaine Jones]

Quoting from message <[email protected]>
posted on 26 May 2006 by William P.N. Smith
I would like to add:

Aha, that's where he gets that broken stuff!

And then of course, you either haven't posted enough, in which case
you are a sockpuppet without your own online identity, or you've
posted too much, which makes you a troll. Ah, well, keeps me from the
other Idiot Box. 8*)

I can't see the accuracy of those figures which he posted as I know
that I made more to some groups; and, of course, he can see no record
of posts which I (and Stubbsy) have made to the various Zetnet
newsgroups.

He does display some of the characteristics of some of the people whom
I meet in the course of my employment.

 

[David G. Bell]

On Friday, in article
<[email protected]>

On alt.energy.homepower, in <[email protected]>,
:

<article not downloaded:
http://slrn.sourceforge.net/docs/README.offline>

Since you're not bothering to read the articles, your opinions on their
posters and content are worthless.

Note that I have said what needed to be said here, and that
you can't do anything about it.

Except explain to the world why you're such a peurile idiot.

If the trolls completely ruin the Usenet (and many of the
best groups have already retreated to mailing lists) then
we have only ourselves to blame.

True, but you seem to be defining "we" in a way which is essentially
meaningless, since it is clear that you have little idea of how to
recognise a troll, and your own behaviour shows many signs of being that
of a troll.

I repeat: Look in the headers, and if you see the
"X-No-Archive: yes" header there, you cannot trust the
person using it and you should killfile them.

Why cannot you trust a person who does that? Shouldn't you be
considering the content of the article first?

Oh, but I forget. You don't bother to read the articles.

And ask yourself why some alias posts through individual.net
when there are better newsservers closer to home. individual.net
is no longer free, and it is a hassle to deal with, so generally
only trolls use it, because it includes no identifiers in
the headers.

And here you come across as a parochial American dipshit. Yes, access
to the news.individual.net server is no longer free, and paying for the
access involves the use of a comparitively obscure European internet
payment service. I'm in Europe--it's a local service and in the UK is
affiliated with the main telephone company. I can, if I choose to, pay
for my NNTP access through my telephone bills.

How is this a hassle for me? I'm willing to concede that it might be
awkward for an American, but that's your local problem, and it requires
a signficant degree of idiocy to regard a local problem as applying to
everyone on the Internet.

As for the lack of identifiers, news.individual.net does have one. It's
just that it complies with European laws on the protection of personal
data--do you have such laws in the USA--which means that you would have
to make a pretty specific request to the server's administrators,
probably with the advice of a lawyer. They do know who I am; they can
trace the money I paid them to confirm it. But they don't tell all and
sundry, or Alan Connor, who their customers are.

And, quite frankly, considering the amound of fraudulent and
exploitative shit that gets sent to my email address from American
sources, I find our European standards to be much more civilised than
those of your big-headed, bully-boy, dishonest, excuse for a country.
Your illusory trolls are no more real than Bush's "weapons of mass
destruction".

(you can learn about this stuff on alt.free.newsservers, but
be warned: the noise-to-signal ratio there is very high)

Clearly, it would be to your advantage to be able to distinguish the
signal from the noise.

Ask "David G Bell" that question. (and all the other aliases
here that post from that server when he is pissed off)

And which aliases, pray, are you referring to? Unless you bother to list
them, that claim is as meaningless as everything else you have written.
Yes, I do have more than one email account, There's one I use for
mailing lists which I don't publicise, and which doesn't get swamped by
advertising emails from American crooks. But which have I been using on
newsgroups? Or are you claiming that I am populating
uk.business.agriculture all on my own?

That would, I think, be a remarkable feat. There are all sorts of subtle
and not so subtle ways in which people identify themselves in text; they
each leave a fingerprint in their choices of words, the rhythym of their
sentences, and the fine details of punctuation.

But I forget. You don't bother to read the content of any articles. You
just look at the headers, and anything beyond the compass of your feeble
intellect is evidence of a troll.

Thanks for your time. I may visit again in the future.

Please, don't trouble yourself on my account. I'm sure there are places
where your presence is eagerly awaited. Perhaps, as Lord Kitchener so
memorably pointed out, your country needs you. And, perhaps, there are
barrels even your country is unwilling the scrape the bottom of.

 

[Jim Webster]

He does display some of the characteristics of some of the people whom
I meet in the course of my employment.

)))
--

Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

..

 

[Jim Webster]

Yes, *that's* what people say when they smell it.

I thought it was some sort of oriental meat subsitutute based on soya!
--

Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

 

[Jim Webster]

Yes, hello to the Aggies! 8*) Amazing what we find to do for
entertainment, eh?

I suppose it is a bit sad really, a troll, a sad shambling creature, a
degraded Remnant of what may once have been a human being, being forced to
cavort and dance for our amusement
--

Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

 

[Pat Gardiner]

I suppose it is a bit sad really, a troll, a sad shambling creature, a
degraded Remnant of what may once have been a human being, being forced to
cavort and dance for our amusement

Usual nauseating glee. Mr Webster has found someone to bully and torment.

He will rally his demented followers and harass the man, instead of ignoring
him.

It has been obvious for a long time that he gets his kicks from trying to
hurt people.

Says it all really. What a splendid fellow for the Country Land and Business
Association to recruit! Says something about their recruitment policies.

Actually, I have been reading some of his doomsday cult stuff elsewhere. It
really is quite unpleasant. It is a good job that every now and again he
runs across someone willing and able to expose his activities to the full
light of day.

 

[Peter Duncanson]

Perhaps, as Lord Kitchener so
memorably pointed out, your country needs you.

Or, in the case of Americans: Uncle Sam.
http://www.snapshotsofthepast.com/war-posters-uncle-sam.html

 

[William P.N. Smith]

Usual nauseating glee. Mr Webster has found someone to bully and torment.

Everyone's gotta have a skill. 8*) I see you two have some
'history', something incomprehensible about "bent vets", which is
either animal doctors who have had cows fall on them or old soldiers
who prefer MOTSS. Either way, get a room. 8*)

 

[William P.N. Smith]

you can't do anything about it.

You forgot "Neener, Neener, Neener", which really would have reduced
me to tears.

I repeat: Look in the headers, and if you see the
"X-No-Archive: yes" header there, you cannot trust the
person using it and you should killfile them.

Not that that's a particularly evil thing to add to one's headers, but
this diatribe appears to have been in response to one of my messages,
which doesn't have such a header.

Running in half-duplex, today, are we Invalid?

 

[Jim Webster]

Have you been visiting the McCartney's web site again?

haven't they sold the brand to some major multinational?
--

Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

 

[Jim Webster]

Everyone's gotta have a skill. 8*) I see you two have some
'history', something incomprehensible about "bent vets", which is
either animal doctors who have had cows fall on them or old soldiers
who prefer MOTSS. Either way, get a room. 8*)

pat? nah he just told lies about me, claimed I am some sort of cult leader.


I quote from "Re: U.S. Launches Mad Cow Criminal Probe"
05 March 2004 13:52

it gives you the idea the sort of person pat is, this is what he said to us

Since I'm unable to get rid of you by use of the kill-file - a problem for
which I will seek a solution by asking on the Usenet.

Do you really want a bunch of geeks disturbing your social club? They have a
reputation for taking a dim view of your kind of behaviour. I will start my
requests for assistance during the course of the next couple of days, if I
find that the kill-file does not function. I would have thought that your
skilful experiment was an invitation for others to use the same technique to
flood ukba with cross posts...still...

Now, I'm going to tackle something else head on, whether you like it or not.
I told you that information on you was being collected and sent to me. Clown
that you are, you decided to take that as a threat and made a series of your
usual ill-founded allegations.

The information related to two of the politburo as you know. I was
astonished at the detail - and frankly did not much care for the nature of
some of it. My wife was terrified by recent events and I did not wish that
any of the other ladies should have similar worries. There have been a lot
of threats flying about.

It is clear, from the information collected, that some of you have been very
careless with posting of personal details of your families on the internet -
and at the same time have deliberately gone out and antagonised people that
might be dangerous. Let's not spell out the detail here. Michael thought he
was the target of my recent comments - although he has done that too, it was
actually you in my mind.

I did give both you and the other individual involved a clear hint that the
information was rather more detailed and sensitive than you might have
suspected. I was flabbergasted on just what was available right down to the
information that a famous sports personality was nearby.

In order not to alarm you, I also told you that I was quite satisfied that
on this occasion the information had been collected harmlessly by someone on
the other side of the world that had no intention of doing you harm. He was
angry with your posting behaviour, asked me what I knew of the pair of you.
I replied with the obvious - very little. In one case not even the name or
location. I then got a mass of detailed information. He was showing his
expertise, until he admitted he was bored with collecting it.

Any normal person would have taken the hint, toned down the idiot
ehaviour - not you - you make it into WW3.

--

such a nice man




Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

 

[Pat Gardiner]

Everyone's gotta have a skill. 8*) I see you two have some
'history', something incomprehensible about "bent vets", which is
either animal doctors who have had cows fall on them or old soldiers
who prefer MOTSS. Either way, get a room. 8*)

Yes, but this is a pretty regular, very unpleasant occurrence.

Mr Webster is a highly influential man and was a key player, with his
associates, during the Foot and Mouth epidemic. He represents the wealthy
farmers and landowners.

He makes sure that anyone proposing anything other than a highly
over-compensated cull of healthy animals gets harassed by his rather
peculiar Vance doomsday cult....and they do make use of multiple identities.

The group are very xenophobic with frequent unprovoked ill-judged attacks on
the US and other overseas countries.

The seem to be acting as some kind of a front organisation for extremist
elements within Britain. Mr Webster certainly showed rather too much
interest in seaport and airport security at a time when there was a
terrorist threat - and they were being picketed by groups of farmers.

Some of the people that fell out with him, with perfectly valid points, are
unable to stand this kind of orchestrated bullying. It is pretty vicious,
even with complaints made to their employers.

Now Bird Flu is on the horizon, alas, and they seek once again to influence
the government by fair means or foul.

 

[K. Jones]

On alt.energy.homepower, in <[email protected]>, "Michelle
Masters" wrote:

<article not downloaded:
http://slrn.sourceforge.net/docs/README.offline>

http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search
Michelle Masters
Results 1 - 23 of 23 posts in the last year
1 alt.energy.homepower
22 uk.business.agriculture

Sure. This is the only group you've ever posted on.

Take a hike, you stinking troll.


Alan

You are the stinking troll, idiot.

*plonk*

K. Jones

 

[Pat Gardiner]

pat? nah he just told lies about me, claimed I am some sort of cult
leader.


I quote from "Re: U.S. Launches Mad Cow Criminal Probe"
05 March 2004 13:52

it gives you the idea the sort of person pat is, this is what he said to
us

Since I'm unable to get rid of you by use of the kill-file - a problem for
which I will seek a solution by asking on the Usenet.

Do you really want a bunch of geeks disturbing your social club? They have
a
reputation for taking a dim view of your kind of behaviour. I will start
my
requests for assistance during the course of the next couple of days, if I
find that the kill-file does not function. I would have thought that your
skilful experiment was an invitation for others to use the same technique
to
flood ukba with cross posts...still...

Now, I'm going to tackle something else head on, whether you like it or
not.
I told you that information on you was being collected and sent to me.
Clown
that you are, you decided to take that as a threat and made a series of
your
usual ill-founded allegations.

The information related to two of the politburo as you know. I was
astonished at the detail - and frankly did not much care for the nature of
some of it. My wife was terrified by recent events and I did not wish that
any of the other ladies should have similar worries. There have been a lot
of threats flying about.

It is clear, from the information collected, that some of you have been
very
careless with posting of personal details of your families on the
internet -
and at the same time have deliberately gone out and antagonised people
that
might be dangerous. Let's not spell out the detail here. Michael thought
he
was the target of my recent comments - although he has done that too, it
was
actually you in my mind.

I did give both you and the other individual involved a clear hint that
the
information was rather more detailed and sensitive than you might have
suspected. I was flabbergasted on just what was available right down to
the
information that a famous sports personality was nearby.

In order not to alarm you, I also told you that I was quite satisfied that
on this occasion the information had been collected harmlessly by someone
on
the other side of the world that had no intention of doing you harm. He
was
angry with your posting behaviour, asked me what I knew of the pair of
you.
I replied with the obvious - very little. In one case not even the name or
location. I then got a mass of detailed information. He was showing his
expertise, until he admitted he was bored with collecting it.

Any normal person would have taken the hint, toned down the idiot
ehaviour - not you - you make it into WW3.

As is quite obvious from the above, and as Mr Webster knows, I was tipping
him off that he had posted rather more personal and family material to the
Usenet than was wise.

He had been deliberately antagonising Animal Rights at the time.

I would have thought that was indeed rather nice, bearing in mind how
obnoxious he had been to me personally.

But you can't get through to a doomsday cult leader, they obviously do seek
to provoke Armageddon.

He did a pretty good job of providing the government with justification for
the Swine Fever/Foot and Mouth culls...."the farmers supported it." This ng
was quoted many times in the farming media - and with approval.

Some farmers did support the culling of heathy animals, but many did not -
their voice was never allowed to be heard on uk.business.agriculture. The ng
fell under the control (self confessed) of paid lobbyists for the Country
Land and Business Association there to stop an alternative view being
expressed. Many were not even farmers.

This is surely not what the Usenet is for - and alternative route for
governments to claim popularity based on the operations of subversives,
cultists and paid lobbyists.

Anyone who doubts me can Google away happily - try "Jim Webster" "Jack
Vance" for starters.

 

[Jim Webster]

you keep telling anyone who will listen that he is a nobody


No he does not
He used to represent any local member of the CLA
That includes non weathly members too


tosh

what pat is groping to say is that I am a published writer and some of my
work can be purchased from Amazon.
Now you can see why I kilfiled him. There is only so much third rate fantasy
you can bring yourself to read
--

Jim Webster.

Pat Gardiner, now in the sixth year of raving about bent vets and still no
result

 

[Day Brown]

Fair enough, but the industry can't send the mash home with it's
employees to distill in their spare time with spare heat.

I aint talking about industry, but family farms, or better yet,
*community* farms like the Athenians had. the neighborhoods owned tracts
of rural land that urbanites would go out to from time to time; like to
be on hand when lotsa help is needed for harvest.

Neighborhoods could do vertical integration just like transnats; have a
bus and a truck to go out to the farm. So- instead of urbanites getting
the exercise they need uselessly in gyms, get it productively by cutting
the firewood needed to *DRAMATICALLY* reduce their heating bills.

They can grow their own veggies as organically as they want- prepared to
suffer the losses from weeds and bugs. But also more careful, such as to
remove all the ripe veggies from a field before spraying it for the next
harvest. Would agribusiness do that?

SO- they get alcohol to run their cars on, and meat from raising the
livestock on the mash (absolutely *certain* there's no mad cow problem).

As middle class incomes get hammered by outsourcing or whatever, there
will be more folks who figure this out, and work deals with farmers like
I see already to produce organic veggies, eggs, milk, etc. And by being
personally involved in this way, and not having to pay for long distance
shipping from Mexico or wherever, this healthy locally grown food is
*cheaper* than what's in the supermarkets.

Libertarians would like it because it completely bypasses regulations;
they cant tell you that you must pasturize and homogenize milk from cows
that *you* partly own. You dont need to pay an FDA meat inspector for
this livestock either. Greens would like it cause they would be better
able to make sure no dangerous chemicals would be in their food.

Small business would like it cause their customers would be spending far
less at Wall Mart and have more money to spend locally. They would also
see more job applicants more able to get by on lower incomes. But big
business, big government, major parties, and big media would hate it
because their collusion would have so little impact on such people.

 

[Pat Gardiner]

Those that hoped to earn something by association with the great and good?

The record speaks for itself. The worst was, of course, the constant
co-ordinated attacks on the Sunday Times journalist Jonathon Miller.

what pat is groping to say is that I am a published writer and some of my
work can be purchased from Amazon.
Now you can see why I kilfiled him. There is only so much third rate
fantasy
you can bring yourself to read

As I say, read my humble writings on shipping and self-sufficiency, then
read Jim Webster on Jack Vance. Try some of the Vanceite forums for a real
chill down the spine. I later found that some of the parallels with the
recent;y publicised Darlington cult, were not so far of the mark.

Do remember that uk.business.agriculture are the newsgroup that currently
spends nearly 700 posts on the best way to suffocate poultry in bulk and
managed to introduce Auschwitz to the discussion. No wonder they arrange to
delete their posts after as little as four days.

Some of Jim's signatures bear examination:

"Reality Facilitor" (I'm told this refers to his real life role playing
games)

oooOOOooo

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

(goodness knows what this was about, given the Auschwitz reference, not
anti semetic I trust?)

oooOOOooo

We worship the inexorable god known as Dangott.
Strangers are automatically heretics, and so are fed to the sacred apes.

(This is it seems a quote from his hero - Jack Vance)

The point is that none of these signatures have anything to do with the UK,
Business or Agriculture.

I think that my posts dealing almost exclusively with corrupt government
veterinarians stand well against the very strange offerings of Jim and his
followers.