Wormhole theory

K

Kevin Aylward

Jan 1, 1970
0
Robert said:
Agree. As I understand it, special relativity is concerned with
non-accelerating reference frames.

This is a common misconception. SR can handle accelerating frames of
references quite well. Its gravitational fields that it cant deal with.
The time dilation effect occurs
without any relative acceleration at all. It's a consequence of the
way we look at things (our reference frame). If we were able to see
the clock in a passing spaceship, it would be going slower than our
clocks. Oddly, if they could also look at our clocks, *our* clocks
would be going slow compared to their clocks.

This seems like a paradox until you see that the rocket frame's t is
being projected onto your own particular time-space trajectory.

Say we have two vectors in the plane, a and b, which are at an angle
theta from each other. If we measure a distance x on both of these
vectors, to us, with our godlike 2d viewpoint, they are of course the
same length. However, think like a flatlander. To a flatlander living
on a, the length along 'a' is just x; however, the length of that
same x on 'b' is the projection along 'a', so its length will be
x*cos(theta); it is shorter. (Since he only has one axis, he must
measure everything relative to that axis.) How much difference there
is depends on how big theta is. To a flatlander living on the other
vector, 'b', however, the situation is identical; he measures the
length x on the local vector as x, but measures x along 'a' as
x*cos(theta); again, it's shorter.
Asking how the other guys' clocks can run slow for both the earthling
and the spaceship guy simply because of a large relative velocity is
the same as one flatlander asking how the other flatlander's x can be
shorter simply because of a rotation.

Velocity in spacetime is like flatlander rotation (although the
projection formulas are different, and quite a bit stranger).

This particular analogy is described in chapter 17 of the Feynman
lectures on physics, Volume I. In it, he describes the lorentz
transformation as a special kind of rotation in spacetime.

Time dilation and physical time differences due to traversing a
different path are not the same. There are *two* distinct effects
occurring in SR referred to under the same general terms, causing much
confusion. Conventional SR "time dilation" is completely equivalent to
an optical *illusion*. For example, two people looking through each side
of a magnifying glass will both see the other as larger. Differences in
aging of different observers are due to path differences travelled in
space-time. This is a real physical effect.

Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.
 
R

Robert Baer

Jan 1, 1970
0
Kevin said:
Ken said:
[...]
And, if so, could this be how we all travel through time,

To be more accurate, we are dragged kicking a screaming through time.
The universe has 4 dimensions. We can move about in three of them.
The fourth, we have no control over our motion in. Our lack of the
control is the only special status that the forth dimension really
has.


This is isn't really an accurate description. Under Special Relativity,
we can, essentially, move forward in time at any rate we please. Simply
moving gets us through time at different effective rates. The time
effects in special relativity can be interpreted in a few different
ways, but as far as net effect goes, travelling at fast velocities is
automatically time travel into the future. We don't actually do anything
to build such a time machine. We cant prevent it happening. That is, if
we go very fast relative to say, the motion of the earth, like go away
and come back, it is usually phrased as time travels slower for the
traveller. The actual reality is that earth would have "aged" on, and we
would not have "aged". This *is* time travel into the future. Its going
backwards in time that's the tricky bit.


If you dropped through an event horizon of a black hole, you
would find that you could move about in what we call "time" and two
of the "space" dimensions but not the third. Along that third
dimension, you would be dragged kicking and screaming to the
singularity where you would be crushed out of existance.

Don't be depressed. You can be crushed to death on any date in
history you choose.




Entropy and the "arrow of time" do seem to be linked. The future is
when entropy will be higher and it is the part of time that we can't
remember.


Time is simply a note that the same object can exist in different
places. That is, objects move.

Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.
Would it not be more profitable and practical to talk about wormholes
in *Apples* or *MacIntoshes* ??
 
R

Robert

Jan 1, 1970
0
John Woodgate said:
I read in sci.electronics.design that Robert Monsen <[email protected]>
wrote (in <[email protected]>) about 'Wormhole theory', on
Sun, 27 Mar 2005:

But with you argument, you have talked yourself into the 'second twin
paradox'. If the 'stay-home' and the 'traveller' have symmetrical
experiences, when they come together, each is younger/older than the
other. For a REAL difference between them, which we know occurs, their
experiences cannot be symmetrical. And the obvious difference is that the
traveller *changed* speed (twice) in his own frame of reference, whereas
the stay-home didn't.

The experiences *can* be symmetrical. How about large relative motion
between the two but they are going different directions in a universe that
is closed. So they pass each other going opposite directions and each sees
the other's clock as slow. When they come back to the same meeting point
after going a great circle trip through the universe each one would have
seen the others time as slow so what do their clocks read (and what do they
see the other's clock as?) as they pass each other on their way to another
great circle trip?

You can get the same effect by both orbiting a large mass or black hole.
With each having a large orbital velocity relative to the other.

I'm aware that they both *are* being accelerated by the bending of a
"straight" line path into a great circle but it seems they would both see
each others clock as slow when they pass at the limit of a very *large*
great circle which would look like linear motion.

Robert
 
R

Robert Monsen

Jan 1, 1970
0
John said:
I read in sci.electronics.design that Robert Monsen



But with you argument, you have talked yourself into the 'second twin
paradox'. If the 'stay-home' and the 'traveller' have symmetrical
experiences, when they come together, each is younger/older than the
other. For a REAL difference between them, which we know occurs, their
experiences cannot be symmetrical. And the obvious difference is that
the traveller *changed* speed (twice) in his own frame of reference,
whereas the stay-home didn't.

Well, to be fair, I was talking about uniform motion, not accelerated
motion. It has been shown that time dilation occurs in particles with
constant velocity. What the particles see, I don't know. However, if you
solve the lorentz transformations for the 'transformed' variables, you
end up with exactly the same transformation with velocity in the
opposite direction...

x' = (x - ut)/sqrt(1-u^2/c^2)
y' = y
z' = z
t' = (t - ux/c^2)/sqrt(1-u^2/c^2)

becomes

x = (x' + ut')/sqrt(1-u^2/c^2)
y = y'
z = z'
t = (t' + ux'/c^2)/sqrt(1 - u^2/c^2)

That implies that the guy who is moving is also going to see your clocks
as going more slowly than his, because nobody can tell who is moving,
since there is no absolute motion. Again, it's a projection of the
moving guy's spacetime trajectory onto your spacetime trajectory that
gives you your sense of how fast the spaceship's clocks are going. The
'angle' between them, or relative velocity, determines how much slower
they seem to the other guy.

However, Feynman also talks about the twin paradox, and notes that it
has to do with the acceleration. The quote is "So the way to state the
rule is to say that *the man who has felt the accelerations*, who has
seen things fall against the walls, and so on, is the one who would be
the younger; that is the difference betwen them in an 'absolute' sense,
and it is certainly correct".

Thus, the acceleration must modify the spacetime trajectory of the
moving twin in such a way as to give her a 'shorter path' through
spacetime. How they see each other's clocks while the accelerations are
happening, or if that is even meaningful, I don't know.

--
Regards,
Robert Monsen

"Your Highness, I have no need of this hypothesis."
- Pierre Laplace (1749-1827), to Napoleon,
on why his works on celestial mechanics make no mention of God.
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward
One integrates the velocity profile, so its the velocity that "causes"
the time difference, not the acceleration.

But the velocity profile would be flat if there were no acceleration.
This is getting into something like the 'voltage-control or current
control' thing. I can just as well argue that the cause is the
twice-integrated acceleration profile, and if that profile is the t axis
(a = 0 for ever)......
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
The experiences *can* be symmetrical.

You are missing the point of the 'second twin paradox'. See below.
How about large relative motion between the two but they are going
different directions in a universe that is closed. So they pass each
other going opposite directions and each sees the other's clock as
slow. When they come back to the same meeting point after going a great
circle trip through the universe each one would have seen the others
time as slow

At this point you jump from assertion to question, and the question is
off the mark.
so what do their clocks read (and what do they see the other's clock
as?) as they pass each other on their way to another great circle trip?

The point is NOT that the twins PASS each other, but that they return to
the same room on Earth, one from far away and one from elsewhere on
Earth. If they both had identical dynamical experiences, they would be
both younger AND older than each other, which is clearly not possible.
The argument that they are still the same age denies that time-dilation
occurs at all, whereas it is proven to occur.

The difference in the dynamical experiences is obvious; the traveller
accelerated to high speed, decelerated to reverse course, accelerated
again to high speed and decelerated again at Earth, **all in his own
frame of reference**. He is not an 'inertial observer' in the SR sense.
The stay-home had none of those experiences.

The apparatus for determining whether you are an inertial observer is
rather simple - a bucket of water. If it sloshes about, you are not
inertial.
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
I read in sci.electronics.design that Robert Monsen
However, Feynman also talks about the twin paradox, and notes that it
has to do with the acceleration. The quote is "So the way to state the
rule is to say that *the man who has felt the accelerations*, who has
seen things fall against the walls, and so on, is the one who would be
the younger; that is the difference betwen them in an 'absolute' sense,
and it is certainly correct".

It's good to know that Feynman agreed with me. (;-)
Thus, the acceleration must modify the spacetime trajectory of the
moving twin in such a way as to give her a 'shorter path' through
spacetime. How they see each other's clocks while the accelerations are
happening, or if that is even meaningful, I don't know.

I don't see a difficulty in principle. The clocks can't become
unobservable or change discontinuously, so their readings at any instant
of either observer's observation must be computable.
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward
But he doesn't have to change his *speed*.

Yes, he does in the case I put forward, which is that the two observers
meet in the same room on Earth after the journey taken by one of them.
This requires four episodes of acceleration (if you count the course
reversal as taking two), not experienced by the observer who remains on
Earth. And, to avoid distractions, I restrict the motion of the
traveller to 'straight line', whatever that means, so that during the
whole journey there is no 'sideways' (orthogonal to the initial
direction of motion) component of speed.
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
I read in sci.electronics.design that Robert Baer
Would it not be more profitable and practical to talk about wormholes
in *Apples* or *MacIntoshes* ??

In apples, yes, but the holes in mackintoshes are due to the Rubber
Clothes Moth, Tinea elastophagia resultans (R. O'Shea).
 
K

Kevin Aylward

Jan 1, 1970
0
John said:
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward


Yes, he does in the case I put forward, which is that the two
observers meet in the same room on Earth after the journey taken by
one of them.

But I am id'ing a case where that isn't necessary.

This requires four episodes of acceleration (if you
count the course reversal as taking two), not experienced by the
observer who remains on Earth.

We dont need this special case.
And, to avoid distractions, I restrict
the motion of the traveller to 'straight line', whatever that means,
so that during the whole journey there is no 'sideways' (orthogonal
to the initial direction of motion) component of speed.

We can dispense with all "accelerations",

http://www.mathpages.com/rr/s4-07/4-07.htm

Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.
 
K

Kevin Aylward

Jan 1, 1970
0
John said:
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward


But the velocity profile would be flat if there were no acceleration.

Yes. intregal(0) is a constant.
This is getting into something like the 'voltage-control or current
control' thing. I can just as well argue that the cause is the
twice-integrated acceleration profile, and if that profile is the t
axis (a = 0 for ever)......

I agree that this is subtle. There is a lot of debate on this in the
relativity NG.

One cant argue that it is the twice-integrated acceleration profile,
because then that makes time a pure function of distance. That is,
independent of how one got from a to b, the time contraction would be
the same. This isnt true. The point is still that it is time contraction
is only a function of velocity.

Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.
 
S

~~SciGirl~~

Jan 1, 1970
0
Started with wormholes, moved to "sock continuum", now to relativity,
(please note I don't understand the math of the Lorentz transformations or
GR yet...)
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward
But I am id'ing a case where that isn't necessary.



We dont need this special case.

If you are going to argue against my example, you can't simply say 'we
don't need it'. The thread developed to the point of putting forward the
'second twin paradox', which can be stated 'Since velocities are
relative, and each twin sees the other's clock going slow, how does it
come about that the travelling twin arrives back younger?'

My answer is that the twins have different dynamical experiences; the
Earth twin remains an inertial observer but the travelling twin doesn't,
and that provides the essential asymmetry.
 
K

Kevin Aylward

Jan 1, 1970
0
John said:
I read in sci.electronics.design that Kevin Aylward


If you are going to argue against my example, you can't simply say 'we
don't need it'.

You were arguing that the twin paradox actually *depended* on one
observer experiencing different speeds, i.e. accelerations with respect
to speed, not direction. I simple gave an explain showing that this was
not the case. Changes in *speed* of the observer are not necessary to
effect aging differences.
The thread developed to the point of putting forward
the 'second twin paradox', which can be stated 'Since velocities are
relative, and each twin sees the other's clock going slow, how does it
come about that the travelling twin arrives back younger?'

As I indicated in another post, this is *two* separate issues. Time
dilation, i.e the two observers *observing* each other's clocks running
slow is equivalent to an optical illusion. The explanation as to why one
observer experiences a net loss of real physical time, requires a
*different*, explanation.
My answer is that the twins have different dynamical experiences; the
Earth twin remains an inertial observer but the travelling twin
doesn't, and that provides the essential asymmetry.

As I said, its much more subtle then this. I did reference a web page on
this, http://www.mathpages.com/rr/s4-07/4-07.htm.

Simply defining an inertial frame, is itself a major problem.

Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.
 
J

Jonathan Kirwan

Jan 1, 1970
0
(please note I don't understand the math of the Lorentz transformations or
GR yet...)

The math behind the Lorentz transformation is dead easy. Simple
algebra.

First, try very hard to mentally assume away any idea of an absolute
(or 'preferred') reference frame and ask yourself how you might start
out to describe the motion of a photon particle traveling at the speed
of light from two different non-preferred perspective frames:

x = c*t coordinate system K

and,

x' = c*t' coordinate system K'

In other words, we make no presumptions about the two reference frames
to each other, __except__ for the fact that they will each observe the
same velocity for the photon. It is as though they are completely
independent to each other.

To make this point come to home deeply and seriously, imagine that the
photon is simultaneously observable in two completely different
universes that have nothing in common to each other except that they
both interact with shared photons.

The above two equations do express the fact that x and x' have nothing
to do with each other except for the speed of light, and that t and t'
similarly have nothing to do with each other except again for the
speed of light. The only thing in common in those two equations is c,
itself. Both independent frames will see that as the same value,
whatever it turns out to be. Other than that, the two frames are
completely without any other shared referents.

Now we write these same two, but with the photon traveling in the
opposite direction, just to get all the possibilities:

x = -c*t

and,

x' = -c*t'


Then we can write:

x - c*t = 0, and also from the last case, x + c*t = 0

and,

x' - c*t' = 0, and also from the last case, x' + c*t' = 0

Of course. Nothing special about that.

But since these are zero, we can now make some statement that combines
both frames:

x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t'), and, x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')

We don't yet know what A and B are likely to be, but that's the
problem to solve.

We can now add and subtract both of these from each other:

x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t') x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t')
+ [x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')] - [x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')]
----------------------------- -------------------------------
2*x = A*x'+B*x'-A*c*t'+B*c*t' 2*c*t = A*x'-B*x'-A*c*t'-B*c*t'

or,

2*x = (A+B)*x' - (A-B)*c*t' 2*c*t = (A-B)*x'-(A+B)*c*t'

All this is pretty basic algebra, accessible to most anyone I think.

At this point, to get rid of the factor 2 (the constants A and B are
just arbitrary ones, so we can create any new ones we want based on
them for convenience and use those instead), we can define the
following new derived constants:

R = (A+B)/2, and S = (A-B)/2

From that, we can re-write the above as:

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

Remember these two, we'll refer to them below.

Well, that's a start. Of course, we still haven't figured out what R
and S are. So let's do so.

At the origin of the one of the frames, we have x = 0, so

x = R*x' - S*c*t' = 0

or,

x' = t' * [S*c/R]

This appears to be in a familiar x'=v'*t' form, if we defined the
velocity v':

v' = [S*c/R]

If so, it would be the velocity for which the origin (or really, any
point) in K is moving with respect to K'.

But in perhaps a little better form, we can write that the
instantaneous change in x' is:

dx' = dt' * [S*c/R]
dx'/dt' = S*c/R
v' = dx'/dt' = S*c/R

Same thing. And v' is the relative velocity of the two systems.

Now, we also know that length of a rest-object in system K observed
from system K' must be the same as the length of a rest-object in
system K' observed from system K (due to the assumption of relativity
-- no preferred point of view.) So let's take a picture, so to speak,
at time t'=0, then

x = R*x'

Let's now look at two points in system K (x-axis) separated by a
distance of exactly 1:

x1 = R*x1'
x2 = R*x2'

and we can also say that, by definition:

x2 = x1 + 1
x2 - x1 = 1
dx = x2 - x1 = 1

But also,

R*x2' = R*x1' + 1
R*x2' - R*x1' = 1
R*(x2' - x1') = 1
x2' - x1' = 1/R
dx' = x2' - x1' = 1/R

Therefore,

dx'/dx = 1/R.

But now, if we look at the picture taken from system K at t=0 and if
we then work to eliminate t' from:

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

then we find:

c*t = S*x'-R*c*t' @ t=0
c*0 = S*x'-R*c*t'
0 = S*x'-R*c*t'
R*c*t' = S*x'
t' = S*x'/[R*c]

substituting into:

x = R*x' - S*c*t'
x = R*x' - S*c*{S*x'/[R*c]}
x = R*x' - S^2/R*x'
x = (R - S^2/R)*x'
x = (R/R)*(R - S^2/R)*x'
x = R*(1 - S^2/R^2)*x'

Now, recall that:

v' = S*c/R

So that it should be clear that:

v'^2 = S^2*c^2/R^2
v'^2/c^2 = S^2/R^2

Substituting,

x = R*(1 - S^2/R^2)*x'
x = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)*x'
dx = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)*dx'
dx/dx' = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)

But we also know that, from elsewhere above:

dx'/dx = 1/R

And from the assumed relativity principle, that:

dx/dx' = dx'/dx

Therefore,

R*(1 - v'^2/c^2) = 1/R
R^2*(1 - v'^2/c^2) = 1
R^2 = 1/(1 - v'^2/c^2)
R = SQRT[1/(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
R = 1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)

From:

v' = S*c/R

we find:

S = v'*R/c
S = v'*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]/c
S = (v'/c)*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
S = [1/(c/v')]*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]/c
S = 1/[(c/v')*SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
S = 1/SQRT(c^2/v'^2 - 1)

So, we've solved for both R and S. Remembering,

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

And with R and S in hand, we are set to find:

x = (x' - v'*t') / SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)
t = (t' - x'*v'/c^2) / SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)

And there you have it all.

All this is based on translation and not upon systems K that rotate
with respect to K' or are under some acceleration, gravitational or
otherwise. That is left for the general theory of relativity to deal
with, where it makes the assertion that there is no difference between
acceleration and gravity, from the point of view of the observer, and
thus that inertial mass (which relates to acceleration) must be the
same as gravitational mass (which, of course, relates to gravity) in a
1:1 relationship. With that assumption in hand, all the fun begins.

Jon
 
R

Robert Monsen

Jan 1, 1970
0
Kevin said:
This is a common misconception. SR can handle accelerating frames of
references quite well. Its gravitational fields that it cant deal with.




Time dilation and physical time differences due to traversing a
different path are not the same.

That is obvious. I was just talking about time dilation.
There are *two* distinct effects
occurring in SR referred to under the same general terms, causing much
confusion. Conventional SR "time dilation" is completely equivalent to
an optical *illusion*.

It's an optical illusion that can slow the decay of particles.
For example, two people looking through each side
of a magnifying glass will both see the other as larger. Differences in
aging of different observers are due to path differences travelled in
space-time. This is a real physical effect.

Of course.
Kevin Aylward
[email protected]
http://www.anasoft.co.uk
SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.


--
Regards,
Robert Monsen

"Your Highness, I have no need of this hypothesis."
- Pierre Laplace (1749-1827), to Napoleon,
on why his works on celestial mechanics make no mention of God.
 
S

~~SciGirl~~

Jan 1, 1970
0
Jonathan Kirwan said:
(please note I don't understand the math of the Lorentz transformations or
GR yet...)

The math behind the Lorentz transformation is dead easy. Simple
algebra.

First, try very hard to mentally assume away any idea of an absolute
(or 'preferred') reference frame and ask yourself how you might start
out to describe the motion of a photon particle traveling at the speed
of light from two different non-preferred perspective frames:

x = c*t coordinate system K

and,

x' = c*t' coordinate system K'

In other words, we make no presumptions about the two reference frames
to each other, __except__ for the fact that they will each observe the
same velocity for the photon. It is as though they are completely
independent to each other.

To make this point come to home deeply and seriously, imagine that the
photon is simultaneously observable in two completely different
universes that have nothing in common to each other except that they
both interact with shared photons.

The above two equations do express the fact that x and x' have nothing
to do with each other except for the speed of light, and that t and t'
similarly have nothing to do with each other except again for the
speed of light. The only thing in common in those two equations is c,
itself. Both independent frames will see that as the same value,
whatever it turns out to be. Other than that, the two frames are
completely without any other shared referents.

Now we write these same two, but with the photon traveling in the
opposite direction, just to get all the possibilities:

x = -c*t

and,

x' = -c*t'


Then we can write:

x - c*t = 0, and also from the last case, x + c*t = 0

and,

x' - c*t' = 0, and also from the last case, x' + c*t' = 0

Of course. Nothing special about that.

But since these are zero, we can now make some statement that combines
both frames:

x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t'), and, x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')

We don't yet know what A and B are likely to be, but that's the
problem to solve.

We can now add and subtract both of these from each other:

x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t') x - c*t = A*(x' - c*t')
+ [x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')] - [x + c*t = B*(x' + c*t')]
----------------------------- -------------------------------
2*x = A*x'+B*x'-A*c*t'+B*c*t' 2*c*t = A*x'-B*x'-A*c*t'-B*c*t'

or,

2*x = (A+B)*x' - (A-B)*c*t' 2*c*t = (A-B)*x'-(A+B)*c*t'

All this is pretty basic algebra, accessible to most anyone I think.

At this point, to get rid of the factor 2 (the constants A and B are
just arbitrary ones, so we can create any new ones we want based on
them for convenience and use those instead), we can define the
following new derived constants:

R = (A+B)/2, and S = (A-B)/2

From that, we can re-write the above as:

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

Remember these two, we'll refer to them below.

Well, that's a start. Of course, we still haven't figured out what R
and S are. So let's do so.

At the origin of the one of the frames, we have x = 0, so

x = R*x' - S*c*t' = 0

or,

x' = t' * [S*c/R]

This appears to be in a familiar x'=v'*t' form, if we defined the
velocity v':

v' = [S*c/R]

If so, it would be the velocity for which the origin (or really, any
point) in K is moving with respect to K'.

But in perhaps a little better form, we can write that the
instantaneous change in x' is:

dx' = dt' * [S*c/R]
dx'/dt' = S*c/R
v' = dx'/dt' = S*c/R

Same thing. And v' is the relative velocity of the two systems.

Now, we also know that length of a rest-object in system K observed
from system K' must be the same as the length of a rest-object in
system K' observed from system K (due to the assumption of relativity
-- no preferred point of view.) So let's take a picture, so to speak,
at time t'=0, then

x = R*x'

Let's now look at two points in system K (x-axis) separated by a
distance of exactly 1:

x1 = R*x1'
x2 = R*x2'

and we can also say that, by definition:

x2 = x1 + 1
x2 - x1 = 1
dx = x2 - x1 = 1

But also,

R*x2' = R*x1' + 1
R*x2' - R*x1' = 1
R*(x2' - x1') = 1
x2' - x1' = 1/R
dx' = x2' - x1' = 1/R

Therefore,

dx'/dx = 1/R.

But now, if we look at the picture taken from system K at t=0 and if
we then work to eliminate t' from:

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

then we find:

c*t = S*x'-R*c*t' @ t=0
c*0 = S*x'-R*c*t'
0 = S*x'-R*c*t'
R*c*t' = S*x'
t' = S*x'/[R*c]

substituting into:

x = R*x' - S*c*t'
x = R*x' - S*c*{S*x'/[R*c]}
x = R*x' - S^2/R*x'
x = (R - S^2/R)*x'
x = (R/R)*(R - S^2/R)*x'
x = R*(1 - S^2/R^2)*x'

Now, recall that:

v' = S*c/R

So that it should be clear that:

v'^2 = S^2*c^2/R^2
v'^2/c^2 = S^2/R^2

Substituting,

x = R*(1 - S^2/R^2)*x'
x = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)*x'
dx = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)*dx'
dx/dx' = R*(1 - v'^2/c^2)

But we also know that, from elsewhere above:

dx'/dx = 1/R

And from the assumed relativity principle, that:

dx/dx' = dx'/dx

Therefore,

R*(1 - v'^2/c^2) = 1/R
R^2*(1 - v'^2/c^2) = 1
R^2 = 1/(1 - v'^2/c^2)
R = SQRT[1/(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
R = 1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)

From:

v' = S*c/R

we find:

S = v'*R/c
S = v'*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]/c
S = (v'/c)*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
S = [1/(c/v')]*[1/SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]/c
S = 1/[(c/v')*SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)]
S = 1/SQRT(c^2/v'^2 - 1)

So, we've solved for both R and S. Remembering,

x = R*x' - S*c*t' and c*t = S*x'-R*c*t'

And with R and S in hand, we are set to find:

x = (x' - v'*t') / SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)
t = (t' - x'*v'/c^2) / SQRT(1 - v'^2/c^2)

And there you have it all.

All this is based on translation and not upon systems K that rotate
with respect to K' or are under some acceleration, gravitational or
otherwise. That is left for the general theory of relativity to deal
with, where it makes the assertion that there is no difference between
acceleration and gravity, from the point of view of the observer, and
thus that inertial mass (which relates to acceleration) must be the
same as gravitational mass (which, of course, relates to gravity) in a
1:1 relationship. With that assumption in hand, all the fun begins.

Jon

I'd get that if you explained the apostrophe. I know it has something to do
with derivatives, but I don't know how to take derivatives quite yet. I'm
getting up to the level at which I can learn to though.
 
J

Jonathan Kirwan

Jan 1, 1970
0
I'd get that if you explained the apostrophe. I know it has something to do
with derivatives, but I don't know how to take derivatives quite yet. I'm
getting up to the level at which I can learn to though.

It's quite simple, I just mean a different x and a different t. Not
the derivatives, at all. I could just as well have used:

e = x'
f = t'

and replaced everything in it, that way. No derivatives meant by me,
there.

Just simple algebra, really.

Jon
 
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