Florescent light bulbs?

[Edward Green]

Yes, it offers a real saving . Not all the energy in your house is used for
lighting, but something like 20-30 % of your energy bills are for lighting,
so you could reduce that to 4-5%, That is the direct equivalent of chopping
16 - 24% off your bill . We have 3 standard incandescent bulbs in our house
( 1 in the fridge, 1 in the oven and 1 in the microwave) all the rest are
fluorescents, and we save about £100 / $200 a year as a result.

Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that waves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air.

[This message brought to you by the Incandescent Bulb Manufactuers
Association]

 

[Elder]

Global warming is happening, and will happen because
planet Earth is still emerging from another major
glaciation. Unless another volcano blasts a metric
buttload of SO2 into the atmosphere ushering in another
dark ages as in 635 AD. Mankind is such a bunch of
babies thinking they have any influence over anything.
Wankers. Maunder Minimum. Little Ice Age. Google it and
weep. Mary Shelley wrote Frankenstein in 1816, the year
without a summer because of a volcanic eruption. Throw
another log on the fire, I'm feeling a bit chilly.

But it is a good way to make us pay taxes.
And like good little sheep, the majority of joe public and wife will
bend over to recieve their orders.
I'm no science major but I know enough to know this is a cyclic planet,
and while cooling killed the dinos but not us (at different times)
because we could adapt. We have to adapt again, not adapt the planet.
That can't be done.

 

[[email protected]]

Oh I know. Between wind turbines, small scale hydro electric running of
brooks and streams, and solar for hot water and electric, in a rural
setting it is easy to either use 12v DC with battery storage or even use
battery storage, innefficient but working inverter technology and DC
power.

One day I plan to do it.

One way to warm your house is to pile 3' of shit around the base.
The tradeoff is clean feet and bugs.

/BAH

 

[redbelly]

20%, is what Al Gore said. He would know better than me. What do you
think the electric power needs of the florescents would be? And where
can I buy a Tesla Bulb?

Perhaps he really said we could save 20% off our TOTAL energy
consumption by switching to compact fluorescents.

 

[[email protected]]

Perhaps he really said we could save 20% off our TOTAL energy
consumption by switching to compact fluorescents.

That number sounds wrong. 20% in Las Vegas..maybe. But not
total energy. How much of our total electric power is used
up in transmitting it?

/BAH

 

[Jim Thompson]

Global warming is happening, and will happen because
planet Earth is still emerging from another major
glaciation. Unless another volcano blasts a metric
buttload of SO2 into the atmosphere ushering in another
dark ages as in 635 AD. Mankind is such a bunch of
babies thinking they have any influence over anything.
Wankers. Maunder Minimum. Little Ice Age. Google it and
weep. Mary Shelley wrote Frankenstein in 1816, the year
without a summer because of a volcanic eruption. Throw
another log on the fire, I'm feeling a bit chilly.

Ah! A refreshing breeze of intelligence!

Did anyone see "Mini Ice Age" on the History Channel a few nights ago?

...Jim Thompson

 

[Richard Henry]

That number sounds wrong. 20% in Las Vegas..maybe. But not
total energy. How much of our total electric power is used
up in transmitting it?

Why should that matter? Savings at the consumption end should result
in proportional savings in transmission.

 

[Joel Kolstad]

"Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that waves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air."

It's only "free" if you have electric heat rather than natural gas or fuel
oil, both of which are cheaper. Even then, it's arguably not quite as good as
a floor heater, since most of the heat will stay up on the ceiling where the
lamp is rather than being forced down to circulate among the people -- I
imagine draftier homes or a ceiling fan may mitigate this, however.

That being said, for people with electric heating, in winter I think running a
few spare PCs on BOINC or something similar is a pretty good idea!

 

[Edward Green]

news:[email protected]...

"Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that <s>aves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air."

It's only "free" if you have electric heat rather than natural gas or fuel
oil, both of which are cheaper. Even then, it's arguably not quite as good as
a floor heater, since most of the heat will stay up on the ceiling where the
lamp is rather than being forced down to circulate among the people -- I
imagine draftier homes or a ceiling fan may mitigate this, however.

[This message brought to you by the Incandescent Bulb Manufactuers

Association] <<<

 

[Elder]

LOL !

He has a curious sense of humour.

See you in alt.goth sometime. How come we don't see you so much in the Saab
group any more btw ?

Graham

No Saab in the household ATM, but I still pop in from time to time. If I
see an interesting story to share, or spot something on Ebay that
somebody might want.

The 900 convertible I bought last August was the start of a very bad
year, the car turned out to be rotten round the windscreen, need a roof,
leaked like sieve and could have used a windscreen after the repair
work. In the end I cut my losses, sold to a german 900 owner from
arround Dusseldorf. He flew over to collect it and drove back over a
long weekend at easter. I bought a Skoda Octavia to replace it but I
fancy another Saab soon. Even the slightly rotten convertible drove
smoother than the Octie on the Mway. It seems wallowy and twitchy at the
same time and the 8v non turbo engine is nice and economical on the run,
but it is a little noisy at motorway speeds, and I miss that punch of
the turbo spooling. I miss a T16S engine.

Since then the year has gone from worse to horrible, made redundant
twice (don't ask how), lost my mother to Cancer, got offered another
job, then got it postponed for another month. All since June.

 

[Elder]

Solar heat evaporates annually some 2-3*10^14 tons of water. Compare
this with any amount of water you'll be producing. Some sense of
proportion is needed.

Amount of water per vehicle per day might be minimal, but multiply that
by millions of vehicles per day it might make a small difference.

 

[Eeyore]

"Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that waves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air."

It's only "free" if you have electric heat rather than natural gas or fuel
oil, both of which are cheaper. Even then, it's arguably not quite as good as
a floor heater, since most of the heat will stay up on the ceiling where the
lamp is rather than being forced down to circulate among the people -- I
imagine draftier homes or a ceiling fan may mitigate this, however.

That being said, for people with electric heating, in winter I think running a
few spare PCs on BOINC or something similar is a pretty good idea!

Unless I have an electric heater on or the washing machine, my largest electrical
load now is easily the PC.

Graham

 

[[email protected]]

"Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that waves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air."

It's only "free" if you have electric heat rather than natural gas or fuel
oil, both of which are cheaper.

No, warmer air due to lighting makes the thermostat kick on
less often reducing your consumption of gas or fuel oil.

 

[Joel Kolstad]

No, warmer air due to lighting makes the thermostat kick on
less often reducing your consumption of gas or fuel oil.

Sure, but it's still cheaper to buy 1kWh of heat from the gas or fuel oil
company than it is from the electric company!

A more interesting comparison might be how efficiently you can light a room
with gas!

 

[Eeyore]

Sure, but it's still cheaper to buy 1kWh of heat from the gas or fuel oil
company than it is from the electric company!

A more interesting comparison might be how efficiently you can light a room
with gas!

There's still some slight evidence here of the gas lighting the place once must
have had.

Graham

 

[[email protected]]

I didn't like the yellowish tint of a pack I bought. Then I noticed at
the
store that that particular brand comes in 3 different color
temperatures
(and they had a live side-by-side display so you could evaluate them).
I don't remember the brand, but if anyone cares I can look it up.

And not all "75W" CFLs have the same lumen rating.

Wow, what store was it that had the live display of lamps?

Sure, could you look up the brand for us... and post the results to
usenet for all of humanity to benefit from. ;-)

Michael

 

[Bill Beaty]

Even then, it's arguably not quite as good as
a floor heater, since most of the heat will stay up on the ceiling where the
lamp is rather than being forced down to circulate among the people -- I
imagine draftier homes or a ceiling fan may mitigate this, however.

Hold on there.

With incandescents, a huge percentage of wasted output takes the form
of near-infrared light. Look at a spectrum plot for a typical bulb.
NIR is basically the same as red light, so if the fixture reflects
light well, then it probably reflects NIR. Both NIR and visible light
will heat the surfaces in the room.

((((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( (o) ) ) )))))))))))))))))))))))
William J. Beaty Research Engineer
beaty a chem.washington.edu UW Chem Dept, Bagley Hall RM74
billb a eskimo.com Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700
ph425-222-5066 http://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/

 

[Bill Beaty]

Why don't you just build the Tesla machine featured
in the film "The Prestige"? Then you can have everything
free, not just energy.

Just bombard a small organic object with a few KW of plasma streamers.
It'll disappear! Then you'll spend quite some time searching for the
duplicate version. In which direction was it projected? Perhaps
you'll need a shovel.

((((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( (o) ) ) )))))))))))))))))))))))
William J. Beaty Research Engineer
beaty a chem.washington.edu UW Chem Dept, Bagley Hall RM74
billb a eskimo.com Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700
ph425-222-5066 http://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/

 

[[email protected]]

Amount of water per vehicle per day might be minimal, but multiply that
by millions of vehicles per day it might make a small difference.
--

It is not that the amount of water per vehicle per day is minimal, but
that the amount of water per billion vehicles per year is still much
smaller than the netural varioation in the figure above. Do the math.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
[email protected] | chances are he is doing just the same"

 

[[email protected]]

Sure, but it's still cheaper to buy 1kWh of heat from the gas or fuel oil
company than it is from the electric company!

And how many kilowatts went up the chimney?