Florescent light bulbs?

[OG]

BOOM! Quite efficiently, but all the light shines at the same time.

Light and heat and improved ventilation

 

[[email protected]]

Why should that matter? Savings at the consumption end should result
in proportional savings in transmission.

Not 20% of _total_ energy distributed.

It is a fact of human consumption that, if a resource is not
used in one place, it will be used in another place. There is
no savings (I'm getting really tired of hearing that word) but
a redistribution.

Now, at the consumer end, there is and incentive to reduce
power usage; the bills are lower and they can spend money
on something else...like a 20'x20' HDTV.

/BAH

 

[[email protected]]

"Well, you shouldn't discount all that free electric heating you get
with incandescents (it's free, because you've already attributed the
cost to lighting). In the winter that waves on fuel bills, and in the
summer it help our airconditioners run longer, to efficiently
dehumidify the air."

It's only "free" if you have electric heat rather than natural gas or fuel
oil, both of which are cheaper. Even then, it's arguably not quite as good as
a floor heater, since most of the heat will stay up on the ceiling where the
lamp is rather than being forced down to circulate among the people -- I
imagine draftier homes or a ceiling fan may mitigate this, however.

That being said, for people with electric heating, in winter I think running a
few spare PCs on BOINC or something similar is a pretty good idea!

In my shop, our CPUs ran so hot we had to air condition the
room even in winter.

/BAH

 

[[email protected]]

Light and heat and improved ventilation

<grin> Yep.

/BAH

 

[Rich Grise]

Are you aware of just how HOT the Antarctic is compared
to 0 deg Kelvin?

Yeah, _I_ am. "They" aren't. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

hmm, how to get gas into a fuel cell...

There are methane fuel cells, but what does a fuel cell have to do with
lighting? Make electricity, and run CFLs?

Haven't you ever seen a gas light? ;-)

"In this year, 1817, at the three stations belonging to the Chartered Gas
Company, 25 chaldron (24 m³) of coal were daily carbonized, producing
300,000 cubic feet (8,500 m³) of gas, which was equal to the supply of
75,000 Argand lamps, each yielding the light of six candles. At the City
Gas Works, in Dorset-street, Black-friars, the quantity of coal daily
carbonized amounted to, three chaldron, which afforded a quantity of gas
adequate to the supply of 1,500 Argand lamps; so that twenty-eight
chaldron of coal were daily carbonized at that time, and 76,500 lights
supplied by those two companies only."
--- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_lighting

So, does anybody wanna do the arithmetic on how much light you get per BTU
of gas vs. electricity? ;-)

I suppose we should count the fuel for the electric plant and for the
refinery here. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

<grin> Yep.

Nah - if you learn to light one properly, the deflagration front is
contained within millimeters of the mantle. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

In my shop, our CPUs ran so hot we had to air condition the
room even in winter.

I have an office like that: 9'4" x 9'6", 8-foot ceiling, and I leave all 4
computers running, and even if it gets down to the 40's, when I come in in
the morning, it's always nice and cozy-warm. If it gets too warm, I just
open the door - it opens out onto an unheated factory.

Speaking of fluorescent lights, just a couple of months ago they got a guy
to redo my ceiling light (which is obnoxiously bright, but there's not
much I can do about it), and the guy refurbished this 8-foot fixture with
iron ballast; he took the ballast and even the socket thingies out, and
installed new socket thingies and electronic ballasts, and essentially
turned the 8' fixture into two 4' fixtures end-to-end. He also gave me
one of those screw-in fluorescents for my desk lamp.

Since the PHB is so cheap, I'm ass-u-me-ing that he's expecting a
significant savings on lighting.

Cheers!
Rich

 

[jasen]

Tim,



I believe the 4 packs of GE compact fluorescents are $9.99 at your local Wally
World --> $2.50 each.

I haven't seen the kind of prices Graham is quoting for non-"no name" bulbs.

I have, maybe it's cheaper to buuild them for 240V operation. Or maybe it's
a socialist plot!

Bye.
Jasen

 

[jasen]

Nuclear power plants don't give off steam.

the cooling towers emit water vapour, which is basically the same stuff.


Bye.
Jasen

 

[jasen]

Amount of water per vehicle per day might be minimal, but multiply that
by millions of vehicles per day it might make a small difference.

how much water do petroleum fueled vehicles produce?

Bye.
Jasen

 

[[email protected]]

When my disk died, I moved to a Toshiba laptop that has one of those
energy star labels on the cover. My power usage dropped 100Kwh/month.

I think it was the terminal that was using most of the power.

It was, with CRT terminals. Since those are disappearing by now, the
worries expressed in this thread about the energy wasted by
screensavers are, if not misplaced, then at least vastly exaggerated.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
[email protected] | chances are he is doing just the same"

 

[Edward Green]

It was, with CRT terminals. Since those are disappearing by now, the
worries expressed in this thread about the energy wasted by
screensavers are, if not misplaced, then at least vastly exaggerated.

And even with CRT's, with modern computers. I had a vintage '99
machine now replaced by a vintage '05 machine, both with CRT's, and I
know that when the machines went to sleep (blank screen) the CRT's
stayed cool. Then, you did say "screen savers"... I guess if you
configure your PC in order to watch bouncing globes on a CRT during all
its idle hours, that's your business.

OTOH, I can see that in a modern office building, there must have been
some time window when concern about the power consumption of 1000's of
idling CRT's would have been a legitimate concern.

 

[Eeyore]

It was, with CRT terminals. Since those are disappearing by now, the
worries expressed in this thread about the energy wasted by
screensavers are, if not misplaced, then at least vastly exaggerated.

You say that but I recently checked the power consumption of my 21" Trinitron vs a 20"
LCD.

The Trinitron is 130W vs 44W for LCD I looked at. Samsung's 21" 213t uses up to 75W !

I'm not going to fret over that especially as I far prefer a CRT.

Graham

 

[Eeyore]

And even with CRT's, with modern computers. I had a vintage '99
machine now replaced by a vintage '05 machine, both with CRT's, and I
know that when the machines went to sleep (blank screen) the CRT's
stayed cool. Then, you did say "screen savers"... I guess if you
configure your PC in order to watch bouncing globes on a CRT during all
its idle hours, that's your business.

OTOH, I can see that in a modern office building, there must have been
some time window when concern about the power consumption of 1000's of
idling CRT's would have been a legitimate concern.

Windows has had the ability to put the monitor into standy mode for yonks !

That's what I do ( after 10 mins inactivity - I'll probably change it to 5 mins shortly )
and don't bother with a screen saver.

Graham

 

[[email protected]]

And even with CRT's, with modern computers. I had a vintage '99
machine now replaced by a vintage '05 machine, both with CRT's, and I
know that when the machines went to sleep (blank screen) the CRT's
stayed cool. Then, you did say "screen savers"... I guess if you
configure your PC in order to watch bouncing globes on a CRT during all
its idle hours, that's your business.

Heck, we pay to watch images dancing on the TV screen, don't we

OTOH, I can see that in a modern office building, there must have been
some time window when concern about the power consumption of 1000's of
idling CRT's would have been a legitimate concern.

Yes, certainly. In the summer it could've been quite a significant
load on the building AC.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
[email protected] | chances are he is doing just the same"

 

[jasen]

Maybe from that paragon of honesty who claimed he
invented the internet...

Al gore never claimed to have invented the internet.

 

[Rich Grise]

And even with CRT's, with modern computers. I had a vintage '99
machine now replaced by a vintage '05 machine, both with CRT's, and I
know that when the machines went to sleep (blank screen) the CRT's
stayed cool. Then, you did say "screen savers"... I guess if you
configure your PC in order to watch bouncing globes on a CRT during all
its idle hours, that's your business.

OTOH, I can see that in a modern office building, there must have been
some time window when concern about the power consumption of 1000's of
idling CRT's would have been a legitimate concern.

I've got a couple of CRTs in my office that turn themselves off if
they're not used - well, they go on standby (or whatever you call it);
and when I activate one, I have to wait for the cathode to warm up again -
I'd think that if they've got sense enough to turn off the filament
supply, they've probably got sense enough to turn off the deflection
circuits and HV. Maybe even the high-level video drivers.

I would. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise, Plainclothes Hippie]

the cooling towers emit water vapour, which is basically the same stuff.

It's a non-issue anyway, since it all falls back onto the ground as rain,
and runs back to the oceans as rivers, except for what soaks in and
irrigates our plants and provides drinking water and stuff. ;-)

And if the sea levels rise, just ask The Netherlands how to build dikes. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

how much water do petroleum fueled vehicles produce?

2C8H18 + 25O2 -> 16CO2 + 18H20

That's with octane - you can do the same with any hydrocarbon.

Hope This Helps!
Rich