Steve Urbach said:Most of the CFL's I have installed make it to 9000 hours.
I mark the "in service" date on the base body. I have a few lamps that run
24/7 that repeatedly make it to rated time.
I have also had a number of DOA's (dead from the start) and a number that
failed in the first 30 days.
Note: in all cases, CFL's were installed in open
fixtures and NOT on dimmers (or electronic timers).
Some long service time failures were spectacular (lots of smoke).
Non-CFL (AKA regular fluorescent) have starter failures that are more frequent
than CFL failures.
That's true Don, but be honest, how often do you look at such stuff ?
Eeyore said:I suppose one approach is to believe nothing.
But that's the whole point, isn't it ? It's a judgement call, which we inMr.T said:In fact it only takes half the people to be fooled, and no real choice for
those who aren't.
In Australia too.
Every time in my case. Some Chinese stuff is excellent value for money
though.
What I avoid at all costs is Chinese shit pretending to be of higher
quality
simply because it has a high price and well known brand name.
Sometimes the extra cost may buy better after sales service, but often not
even that!
MrT.
Getting rid of that crossposting crap, makes me wonder if any newsreaders
can warn when crossposting so I don't have to remember to check.
Most of the CFL's I have installed make it to 9000 hours.
I mark the "in service" date on the base body. I have a
few lamps that run 24/7 that repeatedly make it to rated time.
Don said:There are places you really want to keep incandescent bulbs. I use one
in the lavatory, because generally at night the light will only be on
for a few seconds - nothing like long enough for a CFL to reach its
proper brightness. Also in the main living rooms I have tried CFLs and
rejected them because the light they give is just too unpleasant to
live with. I use CFLs in the hallway and on the upstairs landing. That
will do.
Mr.T said:And the relevence to the current discussion is ..... ????????
MrT.
I suppose one approach is to believe nothing.
But even then not for their full life expectency unfortunately.
And they seem to be both hard to obtain, and expensive. And since the
wattage is approx 1/3rd, the savings are less than claimed.
40degC ambient???
Is that how you get the claimed life expectency, no wonder I never do.
And I still dream of even getting that much. I guess it will happen one day.
With people running lamps 24/7, no wonder we have an energy problem.
Domestic houses don't require permanant emegency lighting in Australia.
And if that's how you get a CFL to last, then there are no power savings to
be had.
My experience too.
And fires have been caused by them as well. A real worry for those 24/7
lamps.
Certainly not IME. I've had some non electronic starters last over 20 years!
Don said:I had a dollar store junker DOA, and another die spectacularly in 3
minutes (lots of smoke and orange burning glow in the ballast housing that
did not stop until I shut off the power).
"I pity the fool who can't follow a thread!"
Arfa Daily said:But that's the whole point, isn't it ? It's a judgement call, which we in
the electronics business, are better placed to make than the average Joe on
the street. As you rightly say, *some* Chinese-manufactured gear *does*
represent very good value for money - but it need not necessarily be 'cheap'
to fall into that category.
It could be cheap and good or cheap and crap. Or
badged and cheap and good. Or badged and cheap and crap. Or any of the same
combinations but with "expensive" substituted for "cheap".
Just because it says "Made in China" on the pack, that doesn't automatically
make it crap. By the same token, just because it says "Philips" or "Osram"
on the pack, that doesn't necessarily make it good. Saying both on the
pack - well, what *can* you say ?
lotteryMaybe, it's not even a make-able judgement call. Perhaps it's just a
Mr.T said:Others keep claiming just because it says "Phillips" it MUST be better.
I am personally not terribly happy about 'excessive' government
regulation, excepting that it has given us (here in the US) clean
water, much cleaner air, much safer cars, better drugs (in general),
and a few other benefits such that we all pretty much live better for
it. The brute fact of the matter is that many must be dragged kicking
and screaming to learning and knowledge... and live in a near-constant
state of denial as long as their personal space is not affected. Since
it is manifest that the average human being would like-as-not even
wipe his/her own butt were it not for social consequences, the sad
result is regulation of what should be within the general condition of
that rarest of all commodities: Common Sense.
Eeyore said:Philips seem to have good QC. That's based on experience.
Philips CFLs were once made in Holland, then in Poland and now in China.
I haven't seen quality decrease.
That'll doubtless be a certification failure.
Don Klipstein said:In my experience, most dollar store CFLs do not have any sign of
certification by UL or CSA, nor FCC. Some show the CE symbol.
I am a bit leery of dollar store electrical items anyway. I once got an
extension cord at a dollar store that claimed UL listing, even mentioning
the file number. I believe that cord was not the one that is legitimately
listed with that file number, because it was rated 13 amps and got awfully
warm at 2.5 amps. The wire appeared to me to be about 24 AWG, maybe 26,
and had much higher resistance than normal copper wire of that size.
I got the cord to see how bad it was. I knew better to actually
normally use a dollar store extension cord that claimed a 13 amp rating
and was thinner than 18 AWG lamp cord. I did report it to UL. I now
cannot find that same cord at any dollar store.
I do see at one dollar store another similarly thin extension cord not
claiming certification and rated for 3 amps, and its resistance is in line
with normal copper wire of 24 AWG. If my ohmmeter was reading high due to
contact resistance, the wire could be anywhere from 24 to 20 AWG. I
consider that one unsafe because it could burn up if a load fails short or
worse still fails with decreased impedance drawing increased current but
not tripping your breaker.
Somehow I suspect 18 AWG lamp cord is the thinnest that reasonably
reliably carries the current through a dead short until a usual household
breaker trips or fuse blows. I don't see 18 AWG extension cords but I see
a lot of 16 AWG ones, so I suspect 16 is the thinnest that is "reasonably
safe" against overloads due to load malfunction.
For that matter, based on the usual ratings of 14 and 12 AWG extension
cords (15 and 20 amps respectively), I feel that the 13 amp rating usual
of 16 AWG ones to be a couple amps on the aggressive side. But enough
digressing from CFLs...
- Don Klipstein ([email protected], [email protected])
extension cord at a dollar store that claimed UL listing, even mentioning
the file number. I believe that cord was not the one that is legitimately
listed with that file number, because it was rated 13 amps and got awfully
warm at 2.5 amps. The wire appeared to me to be about 24 AWG, maybe 26,
and had much higher resistance than normal copper wire of that size.
I got the cord to see how bad it was. I knew better to actually
normally use a dollar store extension cord that claimed a 13 amp rating
and was thinner than 18 AWG lamp cord. I did report it to UL. I now
cannot find that same cord at any dollar store.
I do see at one dollar store another similarly thin extension cord not
claiming certification and rated for 3 amps, and its resistance is in line
with normal copper wire of 24 AWG.
